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Attorneys Fly in to Aid Ramona Lawyer in Fight Over President's Eligibility

Gary Kreep will address the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Pasadena on Monday, representing American Independent Party members.

Gary Kreep says Monday will include the most important 10 minutes of his life.

The Ramona resident has practiced constitutional law since 1975. At age 60, he says he has dedicated his whole life to it.

When he steps into the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Pasadena on Monday, he'll ask a panel of three judges for a chance to show evidence that the president of the United States isn't eligible for the job. He'll argue that Barack Obama wasn't born in this country and that the plaintiffs in his case—members of the American Independent Party—didn't get a fair shake in the 2008 presidential election.

The case was dismissed in the U.S. District Court in Santa Ana in 2009, and the appeal has been on the calendar for two months, Kreep said.

Other attorneys around the country have filed eligibility related cases, but Kreep told Ramona Patch that his is different.

“It's the only case in the country that has been allowed to proceed to oral arguments,” he said.

Others have been dismissed on procedural issues or for lack of merit, Kreep said. He said he can't speculate why his case has progressed this far but that the appellate judges must have found merit in it.

Many Americans believe the argument about the president's birthplace should end with the release of what appears to be his long-form birth certificate this week, according to news reports.

Kreep doesn't agree.

“We don't know whether it's a real birth certificate until our forensic expert has a chance to look at the original,” he said. “All we can go by is what's on the White House website, which looks like a combination of several documents. Computers are too good these days.”

Kreep said the issue of Obama's birthplace was raised in 2004 during the Senate race and again in 2007. He wonders why the president didn't release his birth certificate back then instead of allowing the expenditure of taxpayers' dollars  on legal cases like this.

Asked why he thinks an elected official might keep details of his birth hidden, Kreep said, “Arrogance, stupidity.”

Kreep is executive director of the conservative United States Justice Foundation, a nonprofit group he founded in Escondido with two other attorneys in 1979. The foundation has helped fund six similar legal cases around the country. Kreep said his average donors are “ordinary people who give about $30 each.” They send him donations from all over the country, he said.

Is the high profile and controversial issue making Kreep nervous?

“No,” he said Thursday afternoon, as he prepared to spend the weekend working with three other attorneys who are flying in to help him prepare for Monday. He declined to give their names. Kreep's group also has a consulting forensic expert in documents, Sandra Lines, from Arizona who assists on an hourly basis as needed.

Kreep is representing Wiley Drake and Markham Robinson in the case. Drake was the vice presidential nominee for the American Independent Party in 2008, according to Kreep's legal brief for Monday's hearing. Robinson was the chairman of the party and a pledged presidential elector for the party in California in 2008.

Another candidate, Alan Keyes, represented by attorney Orly Taitz of Rancho Santa Margarita, was the presidential nominee for the American Independent Party.

Oral arguments for the two eligibility cases will be heard together Monday. Each attorney is allowed 10 minutes to talk.

Taitz represented more than 40 plaintiffs when she took the original case to the U.S. District Court in Santa Ana in 2009. Drake and Robinson removed themselves from the case and sought a new attorney. They found Kreep. Taitz later told the court that there were “irreconcilable differences” between her and Kreep, according to Kreep's brief.

The judge ruled that the federal trial court doesn't have jurisdiction to rule on the eligibility issue.

Ramona Patch asked Kreep how he would answer some of the public criticism that people who continue to question the president's eligibility are racist or that they just won't let the issue drop, even in the face of what is considered to be a complete birth certificate?

“I grew up in a black neighborhood in San Francisco,” Kreep said. “I don't care if he's black. People are welcome to think whatever they want.”

Kreep attends Calvary Chapel church and said he's pro life, Republican and not a member of the Tea Party. He dismissed stereotypes about people who've questioned the president's eligibility for the office and said he doesn't consider himself a “birther.”

“And I don't care if Obama's a Christian or a Muslim.”

Those aren't the issues, he said.

Does he support the Tea Party? Some of the people involved in other legal cases against the president have received support from the party.

“It depends. There are lots of Tea parties. I agree with some of them and not with others,” he said.

On Monday, the courtroom is expected to be packed to hear the oral arguments in the appeal. Court staff are telling the public to come early to get a seat. The hearing is the third one on the 9 a.m. calendar.

Kreep said he doesn't know if Ramona residents will be there.

“Hardly anyone knows about it,” he said.

But sometimes he gets death threats from strangers by email, he said.

Does it bother him?

“No. With a name like mine, I'm used to it,” Kreep said.

Kreep ends each phone call in his office with, “God bless you.” In his spare time, he said, he likes to collect antique sports cards. He said he wasn't always a Republican; he was quite liberal in college and has sometimes voted for Democrats. He moved his office to Ramona, he said, because he was able to buy office space instead of renting it.

He said there are several issues regarding the president's citizenship.

"He said he traveled to Pakistan in the 1980s, but on what kind of passport? He said he didn't have a U.S. passport until he was senator in 2004,” Kreep said.

He lists among his successful cases those against school districts over illegal fees they were charging students to take part in cheerleading or to travel to play sports. Although constitutional law is his emphasis, he also does family and business law.

The appellate court will not issue a decision on Monday, Kreep said, but will take an indeterminate length of time to issue a decision. If the panel of judges decides the case can indeed be tried in the U.S. District Court, he expects the U.S. Justice Department to try to block it by filing a writ in the Supreme Court.

The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals is at 125 S. Grand Ave., Pasadena 91105. For directions, click here.

Sharkey April 29, 2011 at 03:30 PM
Can you say, 'frivolous lawsuit?'. After the release of Obama's birth certificate, instead of admitting that they were wrong (that would take character) they 'double down' on stupid. The Judiciary has been far too gentle with these birther kooks. It's one thing to hold one's own beliefs, it's another to clog the legal system with useless cases for the purpose of publicity and to pander to special interests. Hopefully, the release of Obama's birth certificate will allow the judiciary to dispense some justice to these people who hope to use our legal system to try to circumvent the will of our elected government.
kim April 29, 2011 at 04:46 PM
Awesome bout time people verify that this bc is legit good job!!
REBECCA April 29, 2011 at 07:23 PM
I pray that GOD will provail, and for Obama's sake put this behind him. IF I HAD TO PROVE MY CITIZENSHIP I WOULD PLASTER THAT REAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE EVERYWHERE...BUT THIS IS A CERTIFICATE OF BIRTH 2 DIFFERENT FORMS OF IDENTITY!! GET IT RIGHT!
Naeok Sadzewicz April 30, 2011 at 04:18 AM
"Awesome bout time people verify that this bc is legit good job!!" the state of Hawaii verified and has a link to Obama’s Birth Certificate, that makes it Official no need for a forensic experts, if you believe it is fake call the FBI, call the Canadian Mounties, arrest eveyone in Hawaii for waterboarding to find Elvis as he knows where the Kenyan BC lis located. What a waste, Kreep will be lucky if he is not sanctioned
Denise Bartolone April 30, 2011 at 07:07 PM
I also feel in my heart this man is not an American and God bless you for working so hard on this terrible deceitful thing this man has done. My husband and I both think this man wants to destroy America and he's done a pretty good job of it so far. Some people are so mesmerized by this man and my husband & I don't understand how these Washington people don't see what we see. It always come around though. It may take awhile but good always prevails especially with people like you. Good luck to you and we pray that everything will come out before this man destroys America!!!!!
ripalinsky April 30, 2011 at 11:25 PM
I would love for "justice" to be done in this case. I am CERTAIN (in my heart) that Obama was not born Barack Hussein Obama, II, and probably not on 8/4/61. Pen Johannson and Dan Crosby have an excellent article on why 61 10641 is not really out of order, but what it really means.
Naeok Sadzewicz May 01, 2011 at 12:02 AM
over 70 million people think he is Amercan, can you formulate an answer to Kreeps certain failure on this issue, his ffailure is guaranteed (you should learn how to stop hating)
Dave Patterson May 01, 2011 at 11:18 AM
Although I disagree with the premise that Barak Obama was not born in America, I congratulate Mr. Kreep for making it so far and I wish him luck. The courts are where we settle disputes without violence, and we need to keep that door open. If the lawsuit is frivolous it will be deemed so by the courts.
wtd May 01, 2011 at 11:38 PM
Good luck tomorrow, you'll need it - given the history of the ninth district. Your efforts to defend the Constitution are laudable.
tomt May 02, 2011 at 02:21 AM
I agree that Obama is not a american citizen, and has defrauded many things in his past, as well as the present. One of the many things that i can't just release from logic, Obama's Kenyan Grandmother swears that she was present at his birth in Kenya, now this is his grandmother so why not believe her 1st and utmost, Obama's sister said he was born in Hawaii at one hospital, then Obama himself came out and said a different hospital, i smell cover-up from Obama and his sister, and i believe his grandmother.
tomt May 02, 2011 at 02:28 AM
I also read somewhere that at the time Obama traveled to Pakistan, that Americans were not allowed to so under a american passport, if so under what countries passport did he travel on? not sure if that is true, just thought i would put it out there, maybe someone can verify.
Naeok Sadzewicz May 02, 2011 at 04:14 AM
"aybe someone can verify" Pakistan ban is false you can easily look up travel bans for that time why do people that hate Obama lie give it up tomt, do you believe that the entire state of Hawaii is in on it, they certified Obama's birth and linked to the certificate. Call the Canadian Mounities or the CIA, find Elvis and bigfoot they will agree with you. It would be better for you to call a mental health speciallist for help. Irrational hate of Obama causes brain damage. today 1000's of people are at the White House cheering Obama, do you know why? Osama Bin Laden was killed by Obama's order!
Naeok Sadzewicz May 02, 2011 at 04:50 AM
way too mnay lies here to address, man are you gullible, do you push paypal buttons, find and support a candidate to oppose Obama, there is no need to fall for these lies. Hating Obama causes brain damage. Every thing you wrote is false , look them up here: http://www.obamaconspiracy.org/ though I know that you won't look anything up, your hate is too high for reality.
Jon May 02, 2011 at 01:44 PM
Born in the USA? Born in Kenya? A pdf posted on the White House web site is not legal verification of either. The only answer is, "We still don't know." And we can't say the matter is settled until this court handles the PAPER with their hands in official capacity and verifies its validity. What the White House "posted" last week was a political answer to a legal question. It could have been put to rest any number of times since 2004 and has been conspicuously left to rumor, urban legend, and public opinion. Absolutely inexcusable. This man's behavior has generated so much "probable cause" he should never have been allowed on the ballot for state senator, let alone US senator or POTUS. Nothing is settled, nor will it be after these judges kick this case out again without any official examination or investigation of the actual FACTS. No. A pdf on a website is not a FACT any more than a remark made on a street corner. Except of course that it was done. But it means as little. Law no longer matters. It's all down to factional banter in the blogosphere and intimidation by those who wield the power. And we know who that is, eh? It's not Gary Kreep.
LG May 03, 2011 at 08:07 PM
The differences of opinion over Presidential eligibility is not a matter for hoaxters or urban legenders to decide. Events of the past 5-10 years having do deal with the eligibility question are not hoaxes nor urban legends. This is a political debate and should be treated as such.
Jolinda May 05, 2011 at 11:28 PM
Great comment from you Dave, as usual. While I personally am of the opinion that we should join together and support our elected leader after the election, (similar to "after the marriage vows") and not continue to pick apart their sex lives or eligibility or slips-of-tongue or paperwork, I think you helped me to put my head straight in my resistance over yet ANOTHER article about this fellow Kreep, and his lawsuit. You're correct...this IS one of the basic rights that we all should be so proud of in our constitution - whether or not I support his thinking or perspective. While I'm a Ramona girl...I'm writing from Bali at the moment, and being in a different culture SO impresses one with all that is powerful and wonderful with our own! I do hope the Ramona Patch doesn't turn out to be a political platform for either the left or right in our country however as unity and seeking common ground are so greatly needed in looking forward together and making our ENTIRE WORLD a better place for EVERYBODY (regardless of where they happen to be born). We are needing to move into "global consciousness" in this century and to do that we must see what we DO have in common and what will serve all of us in the best way. What I think is a most important thought, and often overlooked, is that "WE ARE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER". Keep up the good and decent balance Dave...I appreciate your writing!
LG May 08, 2011 at 01:14 AM
I am not qualified, nor are any of the people posting on this blog, to evaluate the authenticity of birth certificates portrayed in images posted by Obamers. I leave such evaluation to real experts, if any actually exist, should they obtain access to the original document.
Naeok Sadzewicz May 08, 2011 at 01:57 AM
LG you don't need to be qualified, the State of Hawaii has released and certified Obama's Birth Certificate their official statement is at : http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/News_Release_Birth_Certificate_042711.pdf Loretta Fuddy said. “I have seen the original records filed at the Department of Health and attest to the authenticity of the certified copies the department provided to the President that further prove the fact that he was born in Hawai„i.” This issue is over, unles you can explain how the official agency in charge can make a fraudulent certificate. No court in the US would question the state's statement in above link. So you can see no need for forensics. the Salt Lake Tribune said ""Anyone who remains a birther should seek treatment from a psychiatrist for paranoia." http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/opinion/51719992-82/percent-americans-birther-edwards.html.csp
Naeok Sadzewicz May 08, 2011 at 05:44 PM
"Attorneys to fly in to aid Kreep' that would be Philip Berg, the Attorney that submitted Obama's Canadian Birth Certificate in his first court filing, you know, you know, the one signed by Dudley Do Right. Good Comapny for Kreep, real competence, good luck.
LG May 09, 2011 at 10:53 PM
Ok, so I don't need to be qualified as someone in Hawaii blessed the cert. Makes me feel better already. Now, we can put this thing to bed. That is until Bobby Jindal declares and then it will start all over again. Further, since when does some records clerk in Hawaii trump the Constitution, Congress and Supreme Court? But, as Naeok said, no court in the US would question this; that is for sure.
Naeok Sadzewicz May 10, 2011 at 12:04 AM
Bobby Jindal blew it at last years State of the Union response, so no declaring from him. Republicans have high quality guy in Romney, hope he gets it . "records clerk in Hawaii trump the Constitution, Congress and Supreme Court?" WTF the clerks as part of their job can attest to Obama's birth in Hawaii, what does that have to do with Constitution, Congress and Supreme Court? by the 71 court cases and 12 Supreme Court certs failed so far, Kreep will be denied (remember Berg & Dudley Do Right), Kreep, anticipating failure, has filed for cert with Supremes (as he knows that will fail, he is doing that to get paypal pushes) . You need to find and support a candidate to oppose Obama in 2012, idf you don't Obama will be relected. The birther stuff is over and won't help you.
LG May 10, 2011 at 04:55 AM
I agree, Bobby Jindal should not be on the GOP ticket, most likely as VP. But for different reason than some speech that no one will remember. I've never asked for the "birther stuff" to help me or anyone; I do believe it high time to change the law. Disputes following articles like these prove nothing.
Craig Armstrong September 27, 2011 at 05:30 PM
I suggest two things: First find a U.S. immigration officer, or former immigration officer, trained in detecting and identifying bogus birth certificates and have him/her go over Obama's so called long form Hawaii birth certificate to determine its authenticity. Second: carefully examine Lucas Smith's posting of Obama's Kenyan birth certificate - long form - and do your best to find something - anything - altered, counterfeit, or otherwise bogus about it. Then compare the two. You'll find numerous descrepencies in the Hawaiin certificate, none in the Kenyan certidficate. Craig Armstrong U.S. Border Patrol Agent (retired) Sherman, TX
Dave Patterson September 27, 2011 at 11:35 PM
I watch and hope that Mr. Kreep gets a good chance to challenge power in America. We have few rights left, and if you think it's the Democrats or Republicans, or the liberals or Conservatives that are taking them away, you are being used by the powerful. I want to know what really happened on 9-11, and if Mr. Kreep get's his questions answered in court, we have a chance of getting or 9-11 questions answered also. If we don't speak truth to power we will all be slaves in the end.
Sharkey September 28, 2011 at 03:35 PM
That's true Dave, 'Demorepublicanism functions by keeping us fighting each other over ideologies.' It's nothing more than Fascism vs. Fascism Lite with a Happy Face. But until the system gets overhauled, we have to do all possible to slow the process down and that means stopping the Republicans since they're (wittingly or not) are 'leading the charge' for transferring our wealth to their patrons.

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